Units

Post and discuss your suggestions for future Werewolf versions here.
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Tonex
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Units

Postby Tonex » Fri Apr 05, 2013 11:11 pm

I've been thinking about the unit situation in how many units are underused and others are spammed. Jesse has been stagnating in a way to do this, so in accordance to his rock, paper, scissors of units beating each other, I've planned out a relatively detailed chart so that Jesse can get going >_>. Suggestions are welcome.

<table><thead><tr><th colspan="3">Rock Paper Scissors Idea</th></tr></thead><tr><td>Melee - High hp and armor, moderate speed, moderate damage</td><td>Medium Ranged - Medium hp and armor, low speed, high damage</td><td>Long Ranged - Low hp and armor, high speed, low damage</td></tr><tr><td>Footman - Medium type armor and normal type attack, has ability based on Defend</td><td>Spear Thrower - Light type armor and normal type attack, has ability based on Berserk</td><td>Archer - Unarmored type armor and piercing type attack, has ability based on Poison Arrows</td></tr><tr><td>Knight - Heavy type armor and siege type attack, has ability based on Elune's Grace</td><td>Ax Thrower - Heavy type armor and normal type attack, has ability based on Critical Hit</td><td>Musketeer - Light type armor and piercing type attack, has ability based on Bash</td></tr></table>

Edit: Oh and for model recommendations, keep all of the existing models the same, but use the Bandit Assassin or w/e for the Spear Thrower, and replace the whole Militia unit with the Ax Thrower and require the Ax thrower upgrade for Call to Arms
Last edited by Tonex on Sun May 05, 2013 8:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Slayer4000X2008
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Postby Slayer4000X2008 » Sat Apr 06, 2013 10:05 pm

This makes long ranged seem completely useless. Second best speed, worst damage, worst HP, and worst armour. If anything, swap the speed of melee and long range. That way long range gain the edge in being able to attack and move faster, medium range hold their advantage of having the highest damage output, and melee hold the advantage of being able to take the most hits.
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Tonex
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Postby Tonex » Sun Apr 07, 2013 12:11 am

That's what I was originally thinking so that the ranged can easily kite the medium ranged, but then I realized that It would be the same the melee, so the ranged would actually be unstoppable. Maybe force the ranged units to enter a non-moving stance like the Sniper in Enfos?
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Pwnage
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Postby Pwnage » Sun Apr 07, 2013 5:30 pm

I like your chart and agree with the change Slayer suggested, however, you're not taking into account the strength of Tennants. I once believed that they were now useless with the Archer meta game, but, Tennants are still ridiculously overpowered. I spent the last 15 games massing tennants and I've decided that they are unbeatable. Even with a full army of musketeers/archers/mixed army, tennants will easily overpower armies due to their AOE burst. With the combination of Fish Net/Frost Nova, even the Werewolf at max level after a 3 hour game is no match for their unbeatable strength.
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Tonex
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Postby Tonex » Sun Apr 07, 2013 10:43 pm

The ww should get a passive magic resistance. But if the archers are made faster, how are they supposed to be killed?
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Pwnage
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Postby Pwnage » Mon Apr 08, 2013 10:50 am

If musketeers had a significantly lower range and a moderately lower speed with higher damage, it would be more of a strategy focus fire game. Archers are incredible long range siege units/turtling units and musketeers are often used much more offensively. The largest problem is not in the strengths and weaknesses of units, but in the numbers they are produced in. 40 archers > 13 musketeers even if they have 1/3 of the damage and health.
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Slayer4000X2008
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Postby Slayer4000X2008 » Mon Apr 08, 2013 6:36 pm

Tonex wrote:The ww should get a passive magic resistance. But if the archers are made faster, how are they supposed to be killed?
You kill them with strategy. Send your forces from various directions, with the low health and armour of long ranged they would be forced to run from each group and may wind up trapped and massacred.

To avoid that you simply don't mass one unit type and get various units.
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Tonex
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Postby Tonex » Mon Apr 08, 2013 9:40 pm

Meh I guess that's true.
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Pwnage
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Postby Pwnage » Tue Apr 09, 2013 9:26 pm

The most important thing that should be changed is massing. There are very little reason not to mass one ridiculous unit such as Musketeers, Archers, or Tennants because their positive attributes usually stack among themselves. For instance, if you wanted to destroy a turtle base from a great distance away to ensure tower damage isn't a problem, archers will be your saving grace. If you would like quick medium range burst damage for certain units, musketeers are your best bet. If you want to fuck everything up with AOE then tennants are your best friend. There's not usually a good reason to split your army into two different units. Some people debate that if you want to destroy a base, elite footmen and knights can come in handy along with your archers. Too bad your archers can focus fire the other archers twice s fast because they have double the amount and then they can worry about the currently useless melee units bashing against repairable and stackable walls.
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Tonex
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Postby Tonex » Wed Apr 10, 2013 10:48 pm

Well then, if Jesse did this with the fast long ranged, it'd be fine, right?